NEW PROJECT! -1 +0.5 +0.5

"bob and john" (bobandjohn) 03/08/2017 at 19:00 • Filed to: Project Kijiji

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Good news: the Dr is being sold. hope to have it out of my parents garage by next week.

So long little (big) fella

more good news I bought another thing. and continue to live up to my name of SV wrangler.

yes ladies and gents, I have acquired a THIRD and FOURTH SV650. kind of.

SV #3:

isnt it adorable?

#3 is a gift from fellow oppo chazobandit, who sent it to me for my birthday. Lovely people we have on here.

and SV #4 :

as you can see, its missing a few parts....


Which is why I come to the oppo hive mind. I have 3 options that I’m considering for this engine.

1: Ducati 848/1098 engine.
pros: POWAAAAAAA
con: I’ve seen a sv650 engine in a ducati frame, but not other way around
also, this is like a 4K motor for the 1098 engine. 2k for a 848 motor. and id still need to get throttle bodies for it.

2: SV650 motor bored out to 750CC
pros: really easy to do, basicly be getting a fresh engine, will be like 1/2 the cost of the ducati mill. AND i already have throttle bodies I can bore out for it.
cons: the 650 engine tends to start snapping crankshafts after 85hp...this will be a 95+HP engine. I think I know how to combat it (shave the stator and run a total lose system) but its still pretty much a ticking time bomb

3: Turbo SV650 motor. get a stock SV engine and turbo it. I would lower the max RPM to something like 9.5K to help the crank live. it would be running something like 10 PSI.
pros: COOL! and should I ever break something in the motor, a replacement wont be so hard to find.
cons: expensive. there is ONE guy that made one in the past, and the kit is like 2400$ min.

this is obviously going to be a very long project and I need to build up the frame first, but I want to see what oppo thinks.

Bman76 (hates WS6 hoods, is on his phone and has 4 burners now) > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 18:16

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Procharge the SV engine = Budget H2R

bob and john > Bman76 (hates WS6 hoods, is on his phone and has 4 burners now) 03/08/2017 at 19:02

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dont really feel comfortable riding around on a track with a belt spinning on the outside of the bike.....

DipodomysDeserti > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 19:10

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You ride around a track with a chain spinning around the outside of the bike...

I vote to turbocharge an SV engine. I’d do something really stupid and build an SV bobber.

Bman76 (no it doesn't need a WS6 hood) M. Arch > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 19:10

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Build a cover.

bob and john > DipodomysDeserti 03/08/2017 at 19:16

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frame was in a crash that was a write off, not allowed on street again.

hence, track bike.

also, chain thats designed and built into it some how scares me less then a belt jerry rigged to fit. not to mention S/C is a parasitic loss, not something I am looking for.

bob and john > Bman76 (no it doesn't need a WS6 hood) M. Arch 03/08/2017 at 19:16

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run into cornering clearance issues. not to mention S/C is a parasitic loss on the motor, not something I am looking for.

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 19:20

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#1 Sounds like fun, but pricey. And in the end you’ll have a bike with Japanese styling and Italian reliability/maintenance.

#2 Big bores are sweet, why not go whole hog and have a machine shop make a stronger crank?

#3 LOL
If 85 snaps cranks how do you think it’s going to cope with coming on to boost?

bob and john > Decay buys too many beaters 03/08/2017 at 19:23

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the problem with the SV is that it was a questionable design. the stator on the end was VERY heavy for this bike (you can machine 2.8lbs off of it and still still have the bike run like normal...yes, it was that heavy)

the snapping crank came from the crank being subjected to so much interia changes with the heavy crank the the HP it was making. once you factor in shifting at higher RPM and what not, you can start to see the problem.

if I machine the stator (or just flat out remove it and run a total loose system) I bring that limit up. if I lower the RPM limit and go for more mid-range, I can also get away with it. but I would have to bring the limiter from 11K to like 9.5 or 9.

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 19:31

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But what is it made of? Could you make one from a stronger material?

bob and john > Decay buys too many beaters 03/08/2017 at 19:33

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potentially. something I’ll be looking into with this.

also, I dont really care about maintenance. its going to be a pure track bike.

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 19:43

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You could swap in a KTM big bore single :)

Same power, more torque, half the weight.

CRider > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 19:44

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Find a way to wedge a Rocket 3 motor in there.

Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 19:52

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V8.

Yes I realize this is insane and unrealistic

bob and john > Decay buys too many beaters 03/08/2017 at 19:53

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thats not SUCH a bad idea tbh. but I cant find any worth buying on Ebay. (and I dont mean price restricted, i cant find any period) and if i’m going motor swap, might as well go for something WAY more powerful

bob and john > Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap 03/08/2017 at 19:54

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yea, how about lets not be idiots mm?

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 19:57

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Two KTM big bore singles and a custom block/crank ect in a V-twin configuration?!?

nahh cheaper to just swap in a KTM RC8

Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 19:58

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Might be an issue for me.

bob and john > Decay buys too many beaters 03/08/2017 at 19:59

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LC8*

I looked at them, and they are $3500 engines....

hmmm....

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 20:06

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Ahh damn, that’s what it was called.

Now that would be my choice in engine, ever ridden an RC8R? Feels a lot faster than the specs would have you believe.

bob and john > Decay buys too many beaters 03/08/2017 at 20:09

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I still want to use a SV650 block, if for nothing else then cost (I can get throttle bodies for free) and ease of install.

hmmmm.....grrr. so hard. plus, turbo would have boosty noises....

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 20:14

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I don’t think it’s a good fit, especially in a track bike. The delay between throttle input and delivered torque would make it pretty easy to lowside. The few turbo bikes I’ve ridden were all far more suited to highway pulls and drag strip than cornering.

Real easy to spin up a back wheel if you start to apply throttle out of a turn under the boost threshold.

bob and john > Decay buys too many beaters 03/08/2017 at 20:15

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you call that danger, i call that fun :) (yes, i have issues)

would be neat to have a anti lag system as to not run into that problem...

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 20:18

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Just saying, there’s a reason nobody puts turbos on sport bikes.

Ride something with a CVT and you’ll see just how sketchy it can be when torque changes independently of throttle input.

bob and john > Decay buys too many beaters 03/08/2017 at 20:21

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been there, done that

also, there are ppl who put turbos on sports bike...just not many nutters who track them. ;) hmm. I’ll have to see.

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 20:23

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Exactly, highway pull guys lol

Hey can’t be any harder to ride fast than a 2 stroke right?

jminer > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 20:23

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Interesting, and sounds fun.

You could just buy an early 00s R6 for like $3k and makes 100hp stock and weighs under 450 pounds. Aftermarket and speed parts out the wazoo.

Can’t say as I would take my own advice though- I ride/hoard 40+ year old hondas...

bob and john > Decay buys too many beaters 03/08/2017 at 20:31

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“how hard can it be”

famous last words.

bob and john > jminer 03/08/2017 at 20:32

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yes, but the SV is under 400lbs stock and I got this frame for $50.

also, V-twins are more fun then I4s (to me anyways) whats the fun in being another cookie-cutter 600?

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 20:40

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Why bother having good gear if you’re not going to actually use it, right?

bob and john > Decay buys too many beaters 03/08/2017 at 20:42

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I mean, I prefer not to hit the dirt...err, asphalt...friction and heat dont go well with my delicate posterior.

Decay buys too many beaters > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 20:43

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You could do YouTube reviews of various frame sliders and gear! 

Biggus Dickus (RevsBro) > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 21:05

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Put the ducati 1000 Dual Spark engine. 2 valve Air-cooled awesomeness.

jminer > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 21:06

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Looking at the SV650 frame and orientation I imagine you’d have a hard time putting anything other than a V-Twin or a single in there. I’ve owned many engine formats, and probably driven all of them on a bike. I’ve never been a fan of the V-Twin.

Inline 4's: Fun in old japanese bikes, boring and too damn fast in modern bikes

Parallel Twins: Good combo of usable torque, economy and light weight, good for a beginner bike

Opposed 4's: Weight way low down so good balance, power near that of an inline 4

V4: Fast as hell, but a maintenance mess on a carb’d bike

Single: Thumper- 4 stroke is alright, 2 stroke singles are my kryptonite...

Triple 2 stroke: It’s fun to be weird.

V-Twin: Mostly have ridden cruisers (japanese and american), low end grunt is fun, but shake like hell and are usually pretty heavy.

Good luck with the project though- you should have a blast!

The Compromiser > bob and john 03/08/2017 at 23:21

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OK. This has come around before and I’ve said nothing, but it bugs me. Not you, just in general. Where I’m from, we call it “jury rigging”, not “Jerry rigging”. Is this a regional thing? Others have used “Jerry” and I assume they just don’t know, or are from are far are way land like Ottawa, or Canmore. You however live close enough to me that we’ve broken bread on a few occasions. But you say “Jerry”.

Am I wrong? Have I said it incorrectly for my entire, long life? I feel that it would shake my very fiber of being and cause me to contemplate my life choices....

Maybe chain IS better than shaft drive..................

bob and john > The Compromiser 03/08/2017 at 23:30

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its jerry rig.

roadkill has a shirt that says jerry rig university. so they must be right.

The Compromiser > bob and john 03/09/2017 at 08:09

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My whole life is a lie......

The Compromiser > bob and john 03/09/2017 at 08:19

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!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

: built or put together using the materials that are available a jury-rigged antenna

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

jury-rig play jury-rigged

: to erect, construct, or arrange in a makeshift fashion

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

: organized or constructed in a crude or improvised manner a jerry–rigged plan a jerry–rigged heating system

I say we are both right. I also posit that you are indeed Jerry rigging. If you were Jury rigging, you would be tearing up what was around you to make it work.

Hammerdown > bob and john 03/09/2017 at 10:04

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Track bikes are no fun if they break at the track often. Personally, I would build it with all the best parts and aftermarket pieces available for an SV650. Light wheels, aftermarket front end, etc. Make the parts you need for track use great and worry less about the rest.

bob and john > Hammerdown 03/09/2017 at 12:15

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maybe, but its not like a ducati engine is SO un reliable that if I fart the wrong way its going to break.

and if I want to hit the HP goals I want, the SV motor is just going to snap in 2 anyways.

Nonster > bob and john 03/09/2017 at 13:22

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If you don’t just put a stock or warmed over 650 motor in it then just go with #2, do whatever you can to prevent the crank snappage and just beat it until it blows #thatswhatshesaid

What about the SV1000 motor? I know its heavier, but is there any difference in the SV frames?

Hammerdown > bob and john 03/09/2017 at 14:26

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Then I’d recommend selling that frame and putting the money toward the track bike you want, or building the frame and then selling/trading the frame/bike for something with the HP levels you want.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the idea of a Frankenbike with crazy HP, but I worry about frame strength/ flex with a motor not designed for the frame and all of the other engineering issues that come with shoehorning an engine not designed for a frame.

Sorry for being so boring and reasonable.

bob and john > Hammerdown 03/09/2017 at 15:04

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the thing is, the 650 frame is the same as the 1000 frame, so I know it can take the torque and HP levels i’m asking of it.

I just need to fit the motor I want to it.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > bob and john 03/15/2017 at 10:01

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Be a hero - GET A MOTO GUZZI MOTOR!

bob and john > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 03/15/2017 at 10:03

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wont fit, and they have some of the lowest HP/cc this side of a harley

handyjoe > bob and john 03/16/2017 at 08:04

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What about an RC51 motor? That could put out good power, and it’s a Honda so it should be relatively reliable.

bob and john > handyjoe 03/16/2017 at 13:59

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you know, I havent thought about that...and a quick google shows they are CHEAP engines on ebay ($500 or so)

hmm